Motor take II

[grumpy]

After much thought, and help from the fine people at Dart, we will now have a motor again. Here is the spec on it.

Dart 400 Short block assembly
Dart 11221111P 72 cc heads with 180 runners
Comp 987-16 1.430 springs
Comp cams hyd roller 294/300 .242/.248 .540/ .562 110 deg lobe.
Comp roller ultra pro magnum roller rockers 1.52
Pro magnum push rods
Dart sportsman II dual plane intake
Holley 770 street avenger
Hooker comp headers 2451 full length
Flowmater 2 1/2 American thunder exhaust and series 40 mufflers
MSD HEI
MSD 6AL2
3.73 gear
3200 stall

Dave

[Hank70SS]

Sounds pretty good, too bad you had to replace the other one but this should be a fun one.

[rak1]

Did I miss the story somewhere? What happened to the other motor?

[Ms Grumpy]

Long story short. Took the Chevelle to Milan last Saturday. Made one run and the car was smoking out the tail pipes all the way down the track. Glenn pulled off one of the valve covers and the oil was Black. There were also other problems that we were all shaking our heads at. So we were done for the day.

Engine was pulled on Monday, at that time we found out that we needed to replace the bottom end of the motor. With all that we had put into the car, the one thing that we did not replace was, guess what, the bottom end of the motor.

Thus, the search began. Grumpy spent all day Tuesday researching crate motors, checking stock, asking questions, checking build times, comparing prices, and being frustrated. On Wednesday morning he said "Screw it" and picked up the phone and called DART. We had running around to do and in between our appointments he was on the phone with the builders and DART. We initially looked at the 350, but when we found out that most of the parts we had, that we were going to use, were going to be a direct bolt on to the 400, there was no question on what block we were getting.

My brother and Glenn, met Grumpy and I at DART to pick up the parts. This was great because we were there for about an hour and all the technical questions that we had, were answered. Found out that one of the only changes we have is that the oil pan/dipstick is on the passenger side. I can deal with that.

Let's just say we are all happy. Especially the guys.....MORE POWER!!!

[1969SS396]

Milan Dragstrip?

My uncle lived just a short distance from Milan dragstrip and I can remember as a kid when we visited him the noise from the cars over there racing....I loved it!

Never got to go there as a spectator and they have moved from there (Plank Road) many years ago, still would like to go there and watch. I do make it up to Stanton to watch once in a while.

Sorry for the threaddrift......:D

[rak1]

Milan Dragstrip?

My uncle lived just a short distance from Milan dragstrip and I can remember as a kid when we visited him the noise from the cars over there racing....I loved it!

Never got to go there as a spectator and they have moved from there (Plank Road) many years ago, still would like to go there and watch. I do make it up to Stanton to watch once in a while.

Sorry for the threaddrift......:D
No problem, it happens all the time. Sorry to hear about your motor Ms Grumpy; like you said it will turn out for the best at the end. Oh, Go with BLACK.....

[zombie1969]

One thing you might want to be aware of is camshaft interferance with the rods.Most people who build sb 400 will use a 350 rod because they are stronger.There is more meat where the rod bolts to the crank and its notisable if you sit the rods side by side.This doesent mean you have to replace the cam as I had this situation with my engin and the machine shop didnt tell me after recamending I use 350 rods.I had to clearance the rods to a minamum .080 between the cam and rods.This took a long time and now I know next time to buy a small base circle came.

[Ms Grumpy]

Thanks for the info, but the guys at Dart made sure that everything would work together. And my guys building the motor were right there to make sure that everything was gonna work.

[grumpy]

I gotta question. Do you think a TH350 will stand up to this motor at the strip. I know the weak point for us is the 8.2 rear end but is the 350 up to the task ? Thanks

Dave

[Durand]

Dave:

I'm no expert but if it was properly built, it should handle the output from your engine just fine. T350's can handle a lot more than people think if properly built and maintained.

Durand

[bolly]

my gas peddle broke off the rod some 14 years ago from....... you guessed it.... stompin on it!! TH350 bolted to a 30over 454.... it's still broken off LOL!

[Ms Grumpy]

I don't want anymore broken parts !! Prevention is the best medicine.

[grumpy]

OK, so twice we have tried to run this motor only to have it tick like a sewing machine. Now I am not a very technical person but was wondering if the stock Chevy lifters have something to do with this noise. What do you think ?

[Ms Grumpy]

So frustrated !!!

[Hank70SS]

OK, so twice we have tried to run this motor only to have it tick like a sewing machine. Now I am not a very technical person but was wondering if the stock Chevy lifters have something to do with this noise. What do you think ?

Could be, stock rollers weren't designed to handle much lift and you have a pretty healthy cam.

[Highway Star]

Are you guys running a roller valvetrain setup? It could be your headers, or a small exhaust leak from around the gaskets. Are all the lifters adjusted dead on?

[Ms Grumpy]

Grumpy is trying talking with our guy at Dart and hopefully we can get this figured out.

[Hank70SS]

Are you guys running a roller valvetrain setup? It could be your headers, or a small exhaust leak from around the gaskets. Are all the lifters adjusted dead on?

That's a good point Jake. Ric thought he had noisy lifters. I spotted some exhaust leaks on his headers from some pics he posted here and mentioned that might be the noise. He took care of that and no more noise.

Earlier in the post the engine specs say a hydraulic roller cam.

[Highway Star]

My buddy has an aggressive roller cammed 383. It does tick a little but seems to go away once it is at operating temp. You can't hear it over his pipes once that engine is off idle, too.

[grumpy]

Are you guys running a roller valvetrain setup? It could be your headers, or a small exhaust leak from around the gaskets. Are all the lifters adjusted dead on?

I thought it was headers too but I'm pretty sure its valve train noise. Whats puzzling is the the oil pressure is low. Too say i am disgusted with this entire thing is a huge understatement.

Tomorrow were gonna take it to Dart. Hopefully they can help us get a handle on it.

Dave

[Ms Grumpy]

Please keep you fingers crossed. Either way I think we are bringing it home, the guys don't want it at the shop anymore. If we have to let it sit for a while till we can find the right motor shop, then we will.

I have been pulling out my hair for so long that I am surprised that I still have hair on my head.

[Hank70SS]

What do you consider low pressure and what viscosity oil are you running? Don't be too sure about header leaks. You'd be amazed at how much they sound like metal on metal. A bad leak and you'd swear you threw a rod bearing. Make sure your head bolts don't interfere with the flange of the header. Not sure if this is a problem on small blocks but it definitely is on big blocks with the right combination of head bolts and headers.

EDIT: Good luck, know you've been having enough engine issues and don't need anymore.

[Ms Grumpy]

10-15lbs running it at 40mph, can't remember the Rpms cause I was wathching the oil pressure and temp to see what they were doing when the chatter started. We are running 10/40. The chatter did not start til car was warm.

[Highway Star]

My stock roller cam 350 makes better than 30 psi at that speed. Something is wrong. When was the last time you changed the filter?

On sbc's, depending on headers, it can get pretty tight. I use small head bolts with inset allen key heads...and there are a few that still rub.

What kind of header gaskets? Exhaust port/header port shape?

Just thinkin' out loud here. The oil pressure thing...could the filter bypass be clogged?

[Hank70SS]

My stock roller cam 350 makes better than 30 psi at that speed. Something is wrong. When was the last time you changed the filter?

On sbc's, depending on headers, it can get pretty tight. I use small head bolts with inset allen key heads...and there are a few that still rub.

What kind of header gaskets? Exhaust port/header port shape?

Just thinkin' out loud here. The oil pressure thing...could the filter bypass be clogged?

Another good idea Jake. Ray Barnes fired up his 396 after a rebuild, bypass was blocked, and he had no oil pressure trying to break in the engine. The filter was clogged with assembly lube. Changed the filter and all was good.

[Ms Grumpy]

Not sure when the filter was changed last. I will find out.

[Ms Grumpy]

Check out this thread as I tell you how the saga continues..

http://chevelleforum.org/showthread.php?t=1098

[grumpy]

I just found the dyno sheet and realized I never printed the numbers this motor made.

Peak HP 523.3 @ 5900 RPM
Peak TQ 513.5 @4600 RPM

The motor was still making 505 HP at 6400

Average HP from 3000-6400 was 490.2

Average TQ from 3000-6400 was 488.2